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View Full Version : Why the hell do people use steel plastering beads and caulk corners?????



scottishlad2k10
28-08-2011, 01:12 PM
really starting to get on my nerves some of these jobs we get landed with "steel plastering beads" they are crap! for plastering. they cause many problems! nailed into timber studs that are dried to 12 or 15% moisture content that then get to the merchants and lay about in the pi**ing rain and soak up all that water.

then get slapped into place and plasterboard screwed to it then....... mugs go nailing plastering beads into the still packed with moisture studs and skim it with filler etc. studs dry out a few months later since the beads nailed into the timber stud start moving and filler cracking. (instead of using external steel paper tape designed to stop this as its on the boards not into the timber with nails) and the paint flakes off them. emulsion dosnt stick.

then the lazy cowboy gimps who use decorators caulk in all the internal corners. i dont think this is acceptable at all. mainly as it can shrink and its flexable and doing absolutly no good for the plasterboarding or the finishing." WHY WHY WHY WHY DO IT???"

paper tapes in the externals gives added strenth straighter lines better finish easier to paint and get a proper finish not to mention (caulk) when joiners put the skirtings on it bursts!!! where as paper tape wouldnt unless joiners timbers too long.

might get hate for this but if your caulking and not paper taping your internals YOUR A COWBOY!! :mad::middlefinger:

snappy
28-08-2011, 01:32 PM
Mate i dont know what to say , Here in the land of oz
We use nothing but steel external beads , You would get kicked of site for papertaping your externals where im from .
We dont nail them on we staple them with 8mm staples or just mud them on .
Steel beads dont dint like paper does it keeps a straighter line .
Steel is the premuim product here .
Our conditions can go from 45 degrees celsuis to -2 in 6 months and my house even has steel internal beads (square set perfect angle ) . All up my joint has 187 steel beads 6 years on you would not even find a hairline crack.

amestaper
28-08-2011, 01:41 PM
I think he meant paper internal corners snappy, ive also seen cowboys use decorators caulk for internal corners which kind of eliminates any fire protection.

I like the steel plastering beads too but understand the comment about timber that has been left in the rain for months. That causes warping problems on all the partition though, not just the corners.

scottishlad2k10
28-08-2011, 01:42 PM
Mate i dont know what to say , Here in the land of oz
We use nothing but steel external beads , You would get kicked of site for papertaping your externals where im from .
We dont nail them on we staple them with 8mm staples or just mud them on .
Steel beads dont dint like paper does it keeps a straighter line .
Steel is the premuim product here .
Our conditions can go from 45 degrees celsuis to -2 in 6 months and my house even has steel internal beads (square set perfect angle ) . All up my joint has 187 steel beads 6 years on you would not even find a hairline crack.

well i see that using staples would be better than using nails. the timber here is not the best at all. as the manufacturers dry it out so there is next to no moisture in it but then when they send it out to building merchants the timber lays in a yard.... and gets soaken wet and in ice snow and crappy weather conditions. so why bother drying out the timber when its going to get soaken again you pay for it being dried and get it wet?

if nails are used to stick the beads on then the timber dries out thats when the problems arrise.

have you ever used the steel paper external tape? when used right it can stand a beating. ofcourse if its beaten that bad it will be damaged and need replaced im sure it would be the same with steel beads?

do yous undercoat the steel beads before applying the waterbased coatings?

scottishlad2k10
28-08-2011, 01:44 PM
I think he meant paper internal corners snappy, ive also seen cowboys use decorators caulk for internal corners which kind of eliminates any fire protection.

I like the steel plastering beads too but understand the comment about timber that has been left in the rain for months. That causes warping problems on all the partition though, not just the corners.

yeah your right ames taper. using the caulk in corners isnt acceptable. as it dosnt seal properly as when paper internals are used its a bit of fire protection aswell as a nicer finish. its a bit like installing fire resistant doors then having gaps in under and around them

snappy
28-08-2011, 01:58 PM
well i see that using staples would be better than using nails. the timber here is not the best at all. as the manufacturers dry it out so there is next to no moisture in it but then when they send it out to building merchants the timber lays in a yard.... and gets soaken wet and in ice snow and crappy weather conditions. so why bother drying out the timber when its going to get soaken again you pay for it being dried and get it wet?

if nails are used to stick the beads on then the timber dries out thats when the problems arrise.

have you ever used the steel paper external tape? when used right it can stand a beating. ofcourse if its beaten that bad it will be damaged and need replaced im sure it would be the same with steel beads?

do yous undercoat the steel beads before applying the waterbased coatings?

We have the steel tape here but its seen as a bit of a inferior product , Me personally ive never used it so cant comment and probly wont be able to the builders wouldn't except it
mainly because it would be away from the norm.
Our steel beads get 3 coats . 2 Base coats and the a top coat witch i assume is what you call the waterbased coat . (love how ever country has a differnet name for the same product)
I did think you meant just plan paper tape on the externals . An i get what you mean about the mousture

snappy
28-08-2011, 02:08 PM
Im starting to think we are talking about 2 different things are you talking about steel angle that goes on the studs before the plasterboard is hung

scottishlad2k10
28-08-2011, 02:14 PM
530 < like that but nailed on screwed through the plasterboard into the timber studwork behind :)

snappy
28-08-2011, 02:26 PM
Yeah we use those or one's similar , As i said we staple ours but it doesn't penetrate the timber or we use a tool called a crimper which just crimps them in to the board .
Me i usually just use my mud just lay 10 or so dobs of plaster stick it on trowel it in . Depends how many there are to do .

I must admit i find it interesting you find these crap . I get a great finish out of them but i am also interested in other methods i like learning new ways

scottishlad2k10
28-08-2011, 02:26 PM
531< you use them? i use prd corner tape > 532(Paper joint tape bonded to two corrosion resistant metal strips, for manual application only. Supplied in a cardboard dispenser. For reinforcing external angles in plasterboard construction, and ideal for internal or external angles that are not 90)

but you would never use this for internals without tape or bead would you? > 533

scottishlad2k10
28-08-2011, 02:28 PM
Yeah we use those or one's similar , As i said we staple ours but it doesn't penetrate the timber or we use a tool called a crimper which just crimps them in to the board .
Me i usually just use my mud just lay 10 or so dobs of plaster stick it on trowel it in . Depends how many there are to do .

I must admit i find it interesting you find these crap . I get a great finish out of them but i am also interested in other methods i like learning new ways

i find them crap because i end up going to jobs which other guys not in our firm have done with steel beads and they dont staple or bed them but they screw or nail them into the studs so when the studs dry out the beads move with the timber and cause cracking along with other damage to the plasterboard :) tbh ive never used steel beads. just external paper tape as i find it much quicker and easy to work with its what i was taught to use :)

snappy
28-08-2011, 02:35 PM
Nah never use the caulk thats as dodgy as it comes
, We would use the paper joint tape you have ther for sqaure set ( which is what we call taped cieling to wall ) or angles that are not 90 degree or straight flex
But the premuim product is steel even for internals ,sqaure set and 135 degree internal/externals if you walked to a plaster store here they would have to order in that tape of yours

snappy
28-08-2011, 02:38 PM
i find them crap because i end up going to jobs which other guys not in our firm have done with steel beads and they dont staple or bed them but they screw or nail them into the studs so when the studs dry out the beads move with the timber and cause cracking along with other damage to the plasterboard :) tbh ive never used steel beads. just external paper tape as i find it much quicker and easy to work with its what i was taught to use :)

I reckon the tape would be faster allthough these days blokes are using the stopping boxes on the steel ones thats pretty quick

scottishlad2k10
28-08-2011, 02:41 PM
ah i see why wouldnt they have it on the shelf? lol

yeah i see the guys always using boxes with beads. but im sure you could box the external tape also?

snappy
28-08-2011, 02:47 PM
Not sure , Could see why not though. Im only just learning the ways of the boxes (hate them so far )
Put it this way if that tape of yours becomes cheaper it will probly become mainstream here , Cash is king everone wants it cheaper ,we want more money

scottishlad2k10
28-08-2011, 03:56 PM
Not sure , Could see why not though. Im only just learning the ways of the boxes (hate them so far )
Put it this way if that tape of yours becomes cheaper it will probly become mainstream here , Cash is king everone wants it cheaper ,we want more money

roll of external tape 30m 12.21

roll of internal paper tape 150m 3.40

internal angle bead pack of 5 @ 2.5m 13.29

external corner bead Pack of 5 @ 2.5m 22.49

see :) what i use works out cheaper than beads :) lol

snappy
29-08-2011, 11:41 AM
Ill have to check what the rolls cost here but i know there between $40 - $100 Straight flex is about $50 a roll
Pack of 20 steel externals is $60 for 54m

scottishlad2k10
29-08-2011, 06:34 PM
so your saying $40 - $100 a roll? jesus! thats 25.71 to 64.27 could get 2 to 4 rolls for that here lol $19.00 aud for a roll here :) as for the 54meters of bead for $60 ...... could almost get 3 30meter rolls of external tape for that :w00t:

snappy
30-08-2011, 11:50 AM
Yeah thats Australia for you .
Expensive place . Normal roll of papper tape is $90
A automatic taper (bazooka) will cost $2500-$3500
But there are good things about it to like my work vechicle
534
400+hp 5.4lt v8 ute for brand new $40,000 roughly 20,000 Pounds

scottishlad2k10
30-08-2011, 07:27 PM
Yeah thats Australia for you .
Expensive place . Normal roll of papper tape is $90
A automatic taper (bazooka) will cost $2500-$3500
But there are good things about it to like my work vechicle
534
400+hp 5.4lt v8 ute for brand new $40,000 roughly 20,000 Pounds

5.4litre? you should come visit the uk for a couple of weeks with it. you probably couldnt afford to run it on fuel here for two weeks lol

snappy
31-08-2011, 10:37 AM
Running it here is quickly becoming a problem to . These days
Also the above normal roll of tape $9 not $90 thats a few years away yet

moore
31-08-2011, 10:15 PM
really starting to get on my nerves some of these jobs we get landed with "steel plastering beads" they are crap! for plastering. they cause many problems! nailed into timber studs that are dried to 12 or 15% moisture content that then get to the merchants and lay about in the pi**ing rain and soak up all that water.

You are not the only one with this problem brother . I go through the same B/S on this side of the pond. It's kiln dry timber.... but from the kiln to the site Is a different story.
But then ..that's not there fault..It's ours..[smile]

GMan
06-07-2012, 03:54 PM
Metal Stud, end of problem. Agree about the caulking, however if I was running a partition into an exterior wall I would caulk the internal with overpaintable intumescent firestem. I believe this is a BG detail.

stevebound
12-12-2012, 11:54 AM
really starting to get on my nerves some of these jobs we get landed with "steel plastering beads" they are crap! for plastering. they cause many problems! nailed into timber studs that are dried to 12 or 15% moisture content that then get to the merchants and lay about in the pi**ing rain and soak up all that water.

then get slapped into place and plasterboard screwed to it then....... mugs go nailing plastering beads into the still packed with moisture studs and skim it with filler etc. studs dry out a few months later since the beads nailed into the timber stud start moving and filler cracking. (instead of using external steel paper tape designed to stop this as its on the boards not into the timber with nails) and the paint flakes off them. emulsion dosnt stick.

then the lazy cowboy gimps who use decorators caulk in all the internal corners. i dont think this is acceptable at all. mainly as it can shrink and its flexable and doing absolutly no good for the plasterboarding or the finishing." WHY WHY WHY WHY DO IT???"

paper tapes in the externals gives added strenth straighter lines better finish easier to paint and get a proper finish not to mention (caulk) when joiners put the skirtings on it bursts!!! where as paper tape wouldnt unless joiners timbers too long.

might get hate for this but if your caulking and not paper taping your internals YOUR A COWBOY!! :mad::middlefinger:

Do you own the cowboy to which reference has been made or did you mean you're a cowboy?

E.K Taper
12-12-2012, 11:39 PM
Grammer

Do you own the cowboy to which reference has been made or did you mean you're a cowboy?

Did you mean to spell 'Grammar' incorrectly?:D

amestaper
13-12-2012, 07:01 AM
It seems a forum spellchecker job has just become available.