Newbie apprentice question

**Tee17** · 08-11-2012, 04:59 PM

Hi all, just wanted to ask if a board fixer and a tape and jointer two seperate jobs by two seperate people or does one person have to do both? As ive been told that someone who does stud partitions also had to do the boarding? Thanks.

**crack filler** · 08-11-2012, 05:52 PM

No it can be all separate. But the more you know the better

**Tee17** · 08-11-2012, 05:57 PM

Thank you. Which is the better of the two in terms of money working for a company? Also as i have been practicing making good, do you think it is the correct path for me to go with as i am stuck on what to choose?

**Singing jointer** · 08-11-2012, 06:21 PM

Originally Posted by Tee17

Thank you. Which is the better of the two in terms of money working for a company? Also as i have been practicing making good, do you think it is the correct path for me to go with as i am stuck on what to choose?

Hello tee17 .. I began with making good and believe me it's a good place to start for a while !! It will allow you to see how all drylining applications should be finished ( as it will be you putting rough work right ) not in all cases but certainly with me it was .. I would suggest the natural progression from mg would be to jointing simply because you will be familer with the tools that you already own ! And should be aware of the standard the builder requires ..something some jointers never realise as its put right for them by the mg man

**Brian S** · 08-11-2012, 06:29 PM

Tee, learn to do everything, stud work, both metal and wood, boarding, taping, skimming, MF ceilings, the more you know the more chance you have of keeping the work ongoing, and switching to another trade to earn more or better money

Good luck, and we're all here to give what help and advice we can

**Tee17** · 08-11-2012, 06:46 PM

Thank you Brian and Singing Jointer. In reply to singing jointer, yeah it is tricky to devop
the right technique to make good but that will only come with time and practice for me. Ive also done a bit of corner beads and corners using tape due to the previous jointer being shoddy and rubbish. Do you mind me asking the rough salary or a jointer?

Brian, i done a general level 1 dry lining course so i have decent knowledge and practice on screeding, skimming, boarding and metal studwork. I have done bits and pieces to make good like rebording a box as the boarder used a damp board ao it was very pissed. I have to do a dropped cieling in a boiler box room in a toilet on monday which should give me extra practice. On your advice i should try a fit in with everyone and learn so that of i do get a shout to do a bit of board or metal work i can go ahead and say yes? As i asked above, what is the average salery of a boarder?

thank you guys.

**TonyM** · 08-11-2012, 08:47 PM

There is no average salary mate. It is all down to what you can turn out, because most tapers and fixers work on a price. I know tapers that are earning a grand plus a week on shit meterage rates, 2 coating mass produced houses to a disgraceful standard. I know a fixer that is currently earning over £3k-£4k for a long week. He is a 'machine' though .It's all down to you.

**Brian S** · 08-11-2012, 09:12 PM

Originally Posted by Tee17

Thank you Brian and Singing Jointer. In reply to singing jointer, yeah it is tricky to devop
the right technique to make good but that will only come with time and practice for me. Ive also done a bit of corner beads and corners using tape due to the previous jointer being shoddy and rubbish. Do you mind me asking the rough salary or a jointer?

Brian, i done a general level 1 dry lining course so i have decent knowledge and practice on screeding, skimming, boarding and metal studwork. I have done bits and pieces to make good like rebording a box as the boarder used a damp board ao it was very pissed. I have to do a dropped cieling in a boiler box room in a toilet on monday which should give me extra practice. On your advice i should try a fit in with everyone and learn so that of i do get a shout to do a bit of board or metal work i can go ahead and say yes? As i asked above, what is the average salery of a boarder?

thank you guys.

Yes mate, the more you learn the better, learn how to use lasers, nailguns, infact all the tools that come into your sight, and that does include Taping machines.

**E.K Taper** · 08-11-2012, 09:15 PM

Originally Posted by TonyM

There is no average salary mate. It is all down to what you can turn out, because most tapers and fixers work on a price. I know tapers that are earning a grand plus a week on shit meterage rates, 2 coating mass produced houses to a disgraceful standard. I know a fixer that is currently earning over £3k-£4k for a long week. He is a 'machine' though .It's all down to you.

The flip side of that can also be GOOD tapers leaving houses at a GOOD standard, and being grateful to earn £500! Its all dependant on who you're working for as well as how fast you can churn out houses.
As the others have said, learn to do other trades in this game cos it'll keep the work coming in. I am just a taper but recently got a chance to learn a bit of drylining and glad I did it.
Another string to your bow, as the saying goes.
Welcome to the forum, Tee17, I'm sure there's worse places you could have gone for advice!
Good luck

**Tee17** · 08-11-2012, 09:22 PM

Thanks Tony, looks like i better get practising more and more, but as ive just started out and doing some research on the forum it will be a while untill i get my own flat box and flusher etc. So hand jointing and taping is what i have to perfect for now.

Brian, the company i work for mainly only do new builds like these new housing blocks and new 2 bed homes (for example), im yet to see a t&j in action as im with the making good guy training up. But the quality of work is shoddy so in a way that is good as i get to re corner bead some external angles and paper tape window reveal corners and aimz them all by hand. Filler out internals and externals. but once i get the hang of making good and doing internals and externals i should ask my supervisor to pair me with a t&j do develop my skills further and see what method he uses?

from your experience, are these commerial site builds more about time then quality?
many thanks for all your advice!

**Tee17** · 08-11-2012, 09:31 PM

thanks EK! Yeah i know a bit about drylining too thanks to a course. it has helped me out in the 6 weeks ive been 'making good' training up.
what you said about the £500 reminds me of what i said to a mate today. i said to him id be more then happy with life and comfortable if i was taking home £500 a week once qualified. i guess i have a year of being the 'apprentice' so use it to my advantage and work slow and practice as much as i can doing the most i can like said in my post above.

**E.K Taper** · 08-11-2012, 09:36 PM

Originally Posted by Tee17

Thanks Tony, looks like i better get practising more and more, but as ive just started out and doing some research on the forum it will be a while untill i get my own flat box and flusher etc. So hand jointing and taping is what i have to perfect for now.

Brian, the company i work for mainly only do new builds like these new housing blocks and new 2 bed homes (for example), im yet to see a t&j in action as im with the making good guy training up. But the quality of work is shoddy so in a way that is good as i get to re corner bead some external angles and paper tape window reveal corners and aimz them all by hand. Filler out internals and externals. but once i get the hang of making good and doing internals and externals i should ask my supervisor to pair me with a t&j do develop my skills further and see what method he uses?

from your experience, are these commerial site builds more about time then quality?
many thanks for all your advice!

Spot on mate, it can be a bit of a vicious circle at times. The agents want the houses taped quick as, then moan about the standard of work left by the taper who is working in poor daylight, tripping over plumbers electricians AND kitchen units, and being asked, sorry TOLD, to finish coat his house before the previous coat is even dry!
Think I was starting a bit of a rant there.............

**E.K Taper** · 08-11-2012, 09:41 PM

Aye but there's a difference between making £500 and taking home £500!

**Tee17** · 08-11-2012, 09:46 PM

Originally Posted by E.K Taper

Spot on mate, it can be a bit of a vicious circle at times. The agents want the houses taped quick as, then moan about the standard of work left by the taper who is working in poor daylight, tripping over plumbers electricians AND kitchen units, and being asked, sorry TOLD, to finish coat his house before the previous coat is even dry!
Think I was starting a bit of a rant there.............

ive noticed that already but a good thing about the sites ive visited so far is that the T&J is done straight after the boarding is done so no boilers or plumbers etc are in the way, until you start to make good for example. but yes i do believe its damaging to your work ethic as you want to satisfy yourself with a good job but because your being rushed you have to lower standards and compromise right? unless your supervisor/foreman isnt a wan**r (excuse my language)

**Tee17** · 08-11-2012, 09:47 PM

Originally Posted by E.K Taper

Aye but there's a difference between making £500 and taking home £500!

thats when tax comes into it and expenses like fuel get deducted, would i be correct?
so what would be £500 after tax roughly?

**E.K Taper** · 08-11-2012, 09:51 PM

Originally Posted by Tee17

thats when tax comes into it and expenses like fuel get deducted, would i be correct?
so what would be £500 after tax roughly?

If you're self employed, then tax is 20% so a £500 wage would get you £400 home

**Tee17** · 08-11-2012, 09:55 PM

how did you develop your technique when you started taping and jointing, if you dont mind me asking?

**E.K Taper** · 08-11-2012, 09:56 PM

Originally Posted by Tee17

ive noticed that already but a good thing about the sites ive visited so far is that the T&J is done straight after the boarding is done so no boilers or plumbers etc are in the way, until you start to make good for example. but yes i do believe its damaging to your work ethic as you want to satisfy yourself with a good job but because your being rushed you have to lower standards and compromise right? unless your supervisor/foreman isnt a wan**r (excuse my language)

You're right the taping is done straight after the plasterboard goes on, but sometimes the spark tries to get in before your finished and fit his sockets , generally 2" from the internal corner

. Plumbers sometimes ask to get their radiators on too

And I'm not going to start a rant about kitchen f*****g fitters

**E.K Taper** · 08-11-2012, 10:01 PM

Originally Posted by Tee17

how did you develop your technique when you started taping and jointing, if you dont mind me asking?

Practice mate. Watch different tapers, ask questions, try new methods. It doesnt happen overnight. I'm 42 but still watch other tapers working to see if they do anything different to me.
Watch and learn Tee

**Tee17** · 08-11-2012, 10:05 PM

Originally Posted by E.K Taper

You're right the taping is done straight after the plasterboard goes on, but sometimes the spark tries to get in before your finished and fit his sockets , generally 2" from the internal corner

. Plumbers sometimes ask to get their radiators on too

And I'm not going to start a rant about kitchen f*****g fitters

Had to sort out 3 sockets today in which he done that, he cut his original hole wrong and then cut about an ince away above it for it to be right, so i had to come along and fix his bodge with a insert of board, filler, skrim tape, filler then aimz (aimz to be applied tomorrow)

i already despise kitchen fitters as they fitted the kitchen and boiler cupboards and i had to some how reach over and 'make good' around the boiler pipes going through the cieling, most awkward thing especially as im learning. Not to mention make good on all the 4 cieling corners as they are poorly T&J.

Sometimes i do see work and just think to myself 'when im at the level that they are at, i would always try to do a smart finish to leave less work for the making good guy'
not always, well rarely the case with the commertial jointing i've seen. sucks!