Joint filler and cement beginner question.

**Tee17** · 09-11-2012, 02:09 PM

Ive always applied two coats of joint filler and one finish layer of joint cement is this correct as ive read websites saying one layer of filler to apply tape and then two coats of joint cement and only two coats of joint cement on internals (no filler) which is correct? Thanks.

**crack filler** · 09-11-2012, 04:52 PM

Everybody has there own little ways. It's normally 1 filler 2 joint cement and 2 cement on internals. If you need to speed it up a touch I use a mixture of filler and cement for the middle coat.
Tee are you going to hand joint or machine.

**Tee17** · 09-11-2012, 06:39 PM

Originally Posted by crack filler

Everybody has there own little ways. It's normally 1 filler 2 joint cement and 2 cement on internals. If you need to speed it up a touch I use a mixture of filler and cement for the middle coat.
Tee are you going to hand joint or machine.

ill be hand jointing for now to develop my technique (using filling knives, corner trowel, trowel)
later down the line i do hope to purchase a corner roller, corner flusher and any other hand tools i may find useful.
a bazooka and other machines are our of my price range by a long shot!

the guy im with applies 2 coats filler and one of cement on everything, internals, butts and externals (he is making good what the original jointer screwed up)
advice and tips always welcome
thanks

**amestaper** · 09-11-2012, 06:50 PM

Originally Posted by Tee17

ill be hand jointing for now to develop my technique (using filling knives, corner trowel, trowel)
later down the line i do hope to purchase a corner roller, corner flusher and any other hand tools i may find useful.
a bazooka and other machines are our of my price range by a long shot!

Nothing wrong with hand jointing, so this is really a blessing in disguise. You will get up closer and gain more knowledge learning trowel trades than running around sweating your arse off with a taping gun and boxes while someone else wipes up after you. From experience I know some folks cant hand tape to save their life and have an imaginary sense of grandeur once they start flashing a taping gun around like its a lengendary sword of mythical power.... if you catch my drift. You're taking a better approach into this game whether you mean to or not so stick at it and learn the ropes because it won't be too long before you can afford one.

**Tee17** · 09-11-2012, 07:06 PM

Originally Posted by amestaper

Nothing wrong with hand jointing, so this is really a blessing in disguise. You will get up closer and gain more knowledge learning trowel trades than running around sweating your arse off with a taping gun and boxes while someone else wipes up after you. From experience I know some folks cant hand tape to save their life and have an imaginary sense of grandeur once they start flashing a taping gun around like its a lengendary sword of mythical power.... if you catch my drift. You're taking a better approach into this game whether you mean to or not so stick at it and learn the ropes because it won't be too long before you can afford one.

i understand where you coming from, its like most things where hand and machince are involved, i feel like if i develop my hand jointing and taping technique it will benefit me better. as what you said is true, people that jump in to the machines can sometimes not have the foggiest how to do it by hand.

do people/customers look at weather your a hand jointer or a machine jointer?
i do believe machine would be quicker but the finish wouldnt be as smooth as hand finishing and you can leave that nice feathered edge by hand so a better finish is left after sanding?

**forestbhoy** · 09-11-2012, 10:30 PM

Originally Posted by Tee17

i understand where you coming from, its like most things where hand and machince are involved, i feel like if i develop my hand jointing and taping technique it will benefit me better. as what you said is true, people that jump in to the machines can sometimes not have the foggiest how to do it by hand.

do people/customers look at weather your a hand jointer or a machine jointer?
i do believe machine would be quicker but the finish wouldnt be as smooth as hand finishing and you can leave that nice feathered edge by hand so a better finish is left after sanding?

Decent 3" head and boxes set up well, will leave it tight and a lot faster than by hand. Your wrong there mate.

**Dillon** · 10-11-2012, 04:02 PM

1st coat filler last coat cement, middle coat can be either or a mix. In winter I do 2 filler and 1 cement, and in summer 1 filler and 2 cement. You certainly are going the right route you must learn to hand tape first because the machines do not do it all and you will need hand skills.

**Brian S** · 10-11-2012, 05:20 PM

Originally Posted by Dillon

1st coat filler last coat cement, middle coat can be either or a mix. In winter I do 2 filler and 1 cement, and in summer 1 filler and 2 cement. You certainly are going the right route you must learn to hand tape first because the machines do not do it all and you will need hand skills.

Plus one on that

**Geordiboy** · 10-11-2012, 07:05 PM

Originally Posted by Dillon

1st coat filler last coat cement, middle coat can be either or a mix. In winter I do 2 filler and 1 cement, and in summer 1 filler and 2 cement. You certainly are going the right route you must learn to hand tape first because the machines do not do it all and you will need hand skills.

Tee17 i am a plasterer by trade 20+ years, and moved over to Drywall as thts what houses were being done, then went to Taping / Jointing by hand as was natural for me, then i used boxes and corner finishers but never bazooka could tape the internals a lot quicker by hand, always house bashed.

Externals were always two coats filler even in summer then one coat cement, this way i could complete the houses a lot quicker. Same with Joints only summer used to use if i had time 2 coats cement / 1 filler.

You will get used to your own way when you get on your own, you will find legitimate ways to cut corners but not quality, i always did. Being a plasterer i knew what was required by the builders.

Good luck and keep at it.

Geordiboy

**forestbhoy** · 10-11-2012, 07:54 PM

Originally Posted by Geordiboy

Tee17 i am a plasterer by trade 20+ years, and moved over to Drywall as thts what houses were being done, then went to Taping / Jointing by hand as was natural for me, then i used boxes and corner finishers but never bazooka could tape the internals a lot quicker by hand, always house bashed.

Externals were always two coats filler even in summer then one coat cement, this way i could complete the houses a lot quicker. Same with Joints only summer used to use if i had time 2 coats cement / 1 filler.

You will get used to your own way when you get on your own, you will find legitimate ways to cut corners but not quality, i always did. Being a plasterer i knew what was required by the builders.

Good luck and keep at it.

Geordiboy

Would disagree there mate....

**Geordiboy** · 10-11-2012, 08:03 PM

Originally Posted by forestbhoy

Would disagree there mate....

HaHa

we will have to disagree on that point.

could tape and finish by hand alot faster on HOUSE BASHING and a lot less sanding but that was me had it off to fine art and not bragging. no doubt some tapers with a machine could try and keep up but i never found or seen any that could on Houses.

**forestbhoy** · 10-11-2012, 08:15 PM

Be interesting to see, if all the other machine tapers on here are as slow as me and leave so much sanding as well....

**Geordiboy** · 10-11-2012, 08:28 PM

oops i didnt mean it to sound like that lol ;P

**big g** · 10-11-2012, 10:09 PM

Originally Posted by Geordiboy

Tee17 i am a plasterer by trade 20+ years, and moved over to Drywall as thts what houses were being done, then went to Taping / Jointing by hand as was natural for me, then i used boxes and corner finishers but never bazooka could tape the internals a lot quicker by hand, always house bashed.

Externals were always two coats filler even in summer then one coat cement, this way i could complete the houses a lot quicker. Same with Joints only summer used to use if i had time 2 coats cement / 1 filler.

You will get used to your own way when you get on your own, you will find legitimate ways to cut corners but not quality, i always did. Being a plasterer i knew what was required by the builders.

Good luck and keep at it.

Geordiboy

geordiboy,with respect,you are not working bazooka correctly then,im 56 years of age and gaurantee you i could internal tape a house with bazooka faster than any hand taper and im not the fastest,thats why its such an expensive piece of kit tried and tested over many years.

**Dillon** · 10-11-2012, 10:14 PM

A little of topic here but I find that machine tapers while fast are very untidy and leave any areas that the machines dont do like round sockets, reveals, externals in general, any internals that dont have a clear 6" either side etc etc.

My son works in a gang of three and they do a 4 bed house 3 coats easy in a day all by hand and usually sand one too. And its a good standard too.

**Geordiboy** · 10-11-2012, 10:24 PM

Originally Posted by big g

geordiboy,with respect,you are not working bazooka correctly then,im 56 years of age and gaurantee you i could internal tape a house with bazooka faster than any hand taper and im not the fastest,thats why its such an expensive piece of kit tried and tested over many years.

Big G

i dont mean any disrespect from any of you guys

Machine taping against a good hand taper from the tapers i used to bump into all around South West, i could out perform each and every one speed wise and standard wise (that i mean by standard being left to sand, not overall standard that was good after sanding).

i used to work alongside another guy on a couple of occasions when busy and we could complete a 4 bed 3 coats in a day no bother and to good standard as i take pride in my work myself.

never down there come across any machine tapers who could keep up, no doubt there is fast guys on machines but never came across any in my travels on housing sites.

Geordiboy

**Dillon** · 10-11-2012, 10:31 PM

Lol my dick is bigger than yours lol, Machines are faster but not neater IMO

**Geordiboy** · 10-11-2012, 10:40 PM

Originally Posted by Dillon

Lol my dick is bigger than yours lol, Machines are faster but not neater IMO

Strange Reply LOL

**big g** · 11-11-2012, 01:08 AM

jeez guys,machines have been tried and tested for years and if worked correctly out perform hand taping easily,as for round sockets and leaving a mess thats just bad workmanship,and as for doing any house in a day all i can say is i pity the painters.wheres the drying time in especially the angles.

**TonyM** · 11-11-2012, 08:13 AM

Can you please tell me where you buy the magic jointing materials that can be overcoated so often in a day without forming pinholes or pulling previous coats off? Is it from the same place that sells the magic screwdrivers which outperform collated screwguns? Might be good if you supertapers could upload some close up photos of your 'good standard' workmanship into the joke section of the forum as I could do with a good chuckle. No offence.